Author Topic: Performance x 2! (Read 10197 times)

Duneatic70 · « **Reply #50 on:** April 26, 2013, 11:22:20 pm »

If you think it should be plated & dont want to pay top dollar for hpr19 then buy a pipe that plated for a grand form somebody else & get over it!!!!!!!!!! The high price of a TOP NOTCH BUILDER comes from the EXTENSIVE testing & redoing it to make it perfection!!! You dont wanna pay for it dont buy it & contiue going on & on & on about why you think it should be plated or stamped for the cost of the pipe!!!! Obviously jerry can & will produce a great pipe & knows that it will out perform all others pipes!!! Now can we please get back to the origional thought of this thread of WHAT TYPE OF COATING THE OWNER WISHES TO PUT ON HIS PIPE & HOW EACH COATING WILL CHANGE. HOW THE POWER IS DEVELOPED IN THE PIPE!!

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #51 on:** April 27, 2013, 04:14:06 am »

The original thought of the thread was look two pipes not what coating should go on them. Some people are so sensitive on this forum it's funny. I haven't been going on and on about the cost of the HPR 19 I did go on and on about a quote for machine work triple what other quotes were. The only logical answer anyone provided was the price of that was so high because people pay it. Nobody has explained why the cost of that work is so expensive based on some drastic difference or power gain potential that justifies the cost.

The 19 is a grand that's awesome I'd love to buy one and probably will in a season or two. All I'm saying regarding the 19 is that I'd be a lot quicker to come off a grand for a pipe if it were plated and stamped. That's my personal opinion and preference you don't like it don't comment about it. But don't try to tell someone to stay on topic in a thread that started with 0 topic.

QuadMan8 · « **Reply #52 on:** April 27, 2013, 05:57:20 am »

Marketing 101-- If you have a premium product you can charge and get a premium price. if you product is percieved to be one of the best you can charge a much higher price (to a point of course). If your product is just 5 % better than the compeition you can charge a disproportionate amount more--say 200% even though its only say 5% better. IF people were not actually paying his prices for a pipe or port job than I guarantee you he either would have lowered the price or said, " I cant make any profit at this lower price, so I'll just stop selling them>

So to answer the question why---as said earlier,-- because he can, meaning because people are paying him that amount.

PS...MY POWDER COATER IS SLOWER THAN H%$*.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #53 on:** April 27, 2013, 06:50:26 am »

This^^ finally someone without builder envy and logic breaks it down. The premium price for the pipe I understand as the competition isn't much cheaper at all. It's the machine work cost that boggles my mind as there's only so much gain to be had from a port job and the majority of machinist use templates anyway so a port job is a port job is a port job basically.

PS what are you waiting on from powder coat? I'm waiting on ball joints and cushion arm bearings from Jason then its roller time.

LT250RWV · « **Reply #54 on:** April 27, 2013, 08:05:54 am »

1 thing wasn"t said about Hpr, is service in all of this. Is his customer service and how he will go the extra mile to help you out. Im willing to pay extra money for someone who will sit on the phone help you figure out your problem with your quad. Well worth the money you spend for his parts and quick turn around time also. Beside of all that i like the raw look of the hpr19 or like West Texas idea to make it look blue like in gun metal. I didnt know about the baking chrome for the pipes. This is why i like this site you learn something new everyday.

Mitch Keller · « **Reply #55 on:** April 27, 2013, 08:47:24 am »

Quote from: Motoman991 on April 26, 2013, 03:51:01 pm

The reason for the price being way higher is because people will pay for it.

True, but Jerry wrote it out once, he is not a fast food engine builder, he is a high performance LT500 Specialist (and other makes also) no one is forcing anyone to buy his products, he backs his work and products with fantastic customer service and dyno testing and testing and testing on these 25 year quads.
I can tell you for certain, no one is building a retiring fund on selling pipes for the LT500s.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #56 on:** April 27, 2013, 09:22:53 am »

Finally some good answers instead of combative don't like it shut up type answers. Thanks for the insight 250rWV and Mitch. And again I completely understand the cost of the hpr19 and I don't think it's over priced per say given its competitions price point. I was just expressing my opinion that for that much it'd be nice if it were at least plated. The stamped thing I understand maybe Jerry could work with Shearer to get it stamped out.

Dezsled · « **Reply #57 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:20:24 am »

I guarantee that you won't worry about the cost of Jerry's products once you ride it.... It's like having a steak after living off fast food!

I forgot I regeared 13x42, when I rode it around my house. Fourth gear wheelies!?!

Mitch Keller · « **Reply #58 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:23:37 am »

Mike, put that pic in the LT500 gallery !

Going from old (90s porting, FMF Pipes) to the new ( Q-V-1 V-2 HPR-19 DCS-5) is all up to the consumers wants and budget, any of the pipes mentioned are waking up new found performance in the LT500 world, remember the pipe is one time purchase from $500 to $1000 for great performance, you guys crack me up on this pipe cost controversy, Wanna **** about cost lets get into shock cost!
$750 to $2000 for front shock! Com On thats not even costing out the rear shock !

Dang it I want PEPS $2800

Dezsled · « **Reply #59 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:30:05 am »

Sure thing Mitch

LT250RWV · « **Reply #60 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:33:43 am »

The pipe run the best raw. .Shearer doesnt run any finish on his personal pipes for his quads. If i made a pipe i dont think i would stamp it. Let people guess what just flew by them. + The stamping cost a alot of money. I know one pipe maker told me they had over 8,000$ in stamping lost in the mail. P.s Dez your quad looks great.

Glamisrider · « **Reply #61 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:35:20 am »

Buckeye here's the simple answer......Jerry's work is more expensive because it's worth it!!!

To elaborate, I can not tell you how many friends and people I know who've pay big money to "have their motor done" by some builder and one or more of the following happens:

1) the motor comes back and runs 2 miles and it breaks (usually due to builder "forgetting" to tighten something) destroying your $1,000 cases, $1,500 cylinder, crank, rod, etc...
2) the motor works but not as long as it is suppose to and you have to rebuild it again
3) the motor works but parts are not machined correctly and you have to pay twice to have it done again, correctly this time
4) the motor does not perform like it was advertised or promoted to (it perpetually "needs to be tuned")
5) you get the motor back but you find out it's not the parts you sent in and or or good parts some how disappeared on their own and nobody knows $hit
6) you get your motor or parts back and their done wrong
7) you get you motor or parts back 9 to 36 months later

the builder does not warranty their work against defects in workmanship or stupidity on their part
9) you can reach the builder but their dog ate the cylinder (fill in excuse here) and your motor or parts never materialize
10) your motor/parts never come back, got lost in shipping, the "builder" stops answering YOUR calls and you have to enlist local buddies to pay them a "friendly" visit to secure your parts if they can even find them
11) you send your parts and pay the builder the money and are never able to reach them again, you donated parts & money to their next project.
12) the builder goes down in a ball of flames and does number 11 to a whole group of people

I'm sure I could go on here but you should be able to get the point......when I send Jerry my stuff it comes back quickly, done and done right, if I have questions I can call him, it performs as advertised and it there is an issue I get a phone call to figure out what needs to be done to fix it right instead of getting no call and receiving some slobbed together piece of crap they tried to make work that breaks on my second trip that I spent $500 to take and costing me thousands in parts and labor to have it redone right.

Glamisrider · « **Reply #62 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:44:02 am »

Hey Dez, is your cushion lever in upside down, the bike looks a bit high.

BTW NICE BIKE and by now I'm sure you're already in love with your HPR19

Dezsled · « **Reply #63 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:46:13 am »

It does sit abit high... I'll look into that.

Thanks for all the complements, it's been 10 months to get to this point. Yeah I still have a grin from testing

I have to say again, I should have bought a Zilla a long time ago. I got the ltr450 and never ride it.

Mitch Keller · « **Reply #64 on:** April 27, 2013, 10:53:00 am »

Quote from: Glamisrider on April 27, 2013, 10:35:20 am

Buckeye here's the simple answer......Jerry's work is more expensive because it's worth it!!!

To elaborate, I can not tell you how many friends and people I know who've pay big money to "have their motor done" by some builder and one or more of the following happens:

1) the motor comes back and runs 2 miles and it breaks (usually due to builder "forgetting" to tighten something) destroying your $1,000 cases, $1,500 cylinder, crank, rod, etc...
2) the motor works but not as long as it is suppose to and you have to rebuild it again
3) the motor works but parts are not machined correctly and you have to pay twice to have it done again, correctly this time
4) the motor does not perform like it was advertised or promoted to (it perpetually "needs to be tuned")
5) you get the motor back but you find out it's not the parts you sent in and or or good parts some how disappeared on their own and nobody knows $hit
6) you get your motor or parts back and their done wrong
7) you get you motor or parts back 9 to 36 months later
the builder does not warranty their work against defects in workmanship or stupidity on their part
9) you can reach the builder but their dog ate the cylinder (fill in excuse here) and your motor or parts never materialize
10) your motor/parts never come back, got lost in shipping, the "builder" stops answering YOUR calls and you have to enlist local buddies to pay them a "friendly" visit to secure your parts if they can even find them
11) you send your parts and pay the builder the money and are never able to reach them again, you donated parts & money to their next project.
12) the builder goes down in a ball of flames and does number 11 to a whole group of people

I'm sure I could go on here but you should be able to get the point......when I send Jerry my stuff it comes back quickly, done and done right, if I have questions I can call him, it performs as advertised and it there is an issue I get a phone call to figure out what needs to be done to fix it right instead of getting no call and receiving some slobbed together piece of crap they tried to make work that breaks on my second trip that I spent $500 to take and costing me thousands in parts and labor to have it redone right.

#06 took 18 months, #04 Made Less HP after than before!

Zilla273 · « **Reply #65 on:** April 27, 2013, 11:12:19 am »

Jerry's port work is more $ because he has a better layout, plain and simple. Also Q claimed in his youtube video that Z hybrid he raced had 12hp more then any other zilla related bike on some particular dyno he ran it on. Well if he had 12hp more then that HPR zilla i seen in that vid, it's frame must be full of lead.

Mitch Keller · « **Reply #66 on:** April 27, 2013, 11:48:36 am »

Sounds like a rematch to me..............

Dezsled · « **Reply #67 on:** April 27, 2013, 12:02:06 pm »

I agree there needs to be another race off...

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #68 on:** April 27, 2013, 12:36:44 pm »

Where's the video with that claim at? And I agree I think they should run again. I thought they should run 5 or 6 times that day in dumont.

Mitch Keller · « **Reply #69 on:** April 27, 2013, 12:57:51 pm »

I'm betting man, to say if we were to re-do the dyno testing again with a Matt Sheare's ported LT500 engine and pipe combo we might have seen some different graphs, and this is the point I want to make about each builder has there own recipe they use to build an engine (Pipe, Porting, Head, Carb,Clutch), change one thing and the end results will differ, the graph testing we did was to use a average 90s type of porting with pipes, and used Dales HPR Dunner Ported quad, the results were not for bashing, only to see the graphs from each pipe effect on each engine, the results are what they are.

Zilla273 · « **Reply #70 on:** April 27, 2013, 01:49:55 pm »

its on youtube man, its one of the vids when he 1rst gets it done, he mentions running twin carbs, said one of his new marvin front shocks is leaking etc,

Alkyzilla · « **Reply #71 on:** April 27, 2013, 05:52:50 pm »

I think everyone should quit picking on poor Buckeye513...He has already figured out on his own that every builder uses the same "port template" and that the workmanship part is not relevant, its all cookie cutter stuff...and a ugly pipe is just a ugly pipe! Leave him be! Like I said...he will always be good for a chuckle at the Hill or a Drag strip.

Dezsled · « **Reply #72 on:** April 27, 2013, 06:24:39 pm »

Quote from: Alkyzilla on April 27, 2013, 05:52:50 pm

I think everyone should quit picking on poor Buckeye513...He has already figured out on his own that every builder uses the same "port template" and that the workmanship part is not relevant, its all cookie cutter stuff...and a ugly pipe is just a ugly pipe! Leave him be! Like I said...he will always be good for a chuckle at the Hill or a Drag strip.

Dang I should be going to the kitchen utensil store for my newest porting job! Can my ole lady's hand mixer run a carbide cutting bit?!? What's the best - Christmas cookie port or cake decoration porting?

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #73 on:** April 27, 2013, 06:55:44 pm »

Good to know that machinists in dales book just go crazy with grinding tools and carbides on a cylinder with no pre determined design or end result in mind aka a template. So what dale is saying is that Jerry personally ports every single cylinder that comes into his shop. That's amazing! It's really to bad that you'll never see me at a strip or hill dale cause I'm literally 2 months into working on a Zilla and I've only seen you ride one hill run (which you lost to a banshee) and I know I could easily hop on a bike that was equal to whatever you were riding and out ride you on a hill, a strip, a trail, or a street hell for that matter the bikes wouldn't even have to be equal just similarly matched. It's guys like you that amuse the **** out of me spend all this money think you're a big badass on 4 wheels and can easily get out ridden by someone half you're age who has probably twice the seat time on a bike as you do. It's so freaking hilarious how upset my opinions can get grown men and get such a rise out of you guys that you feel the need to mock or make fun of me like you're in the cafeteria in 8th grade. Hilarious to say the least.

Oh and Cunningham told me to trek over to pa to take a few runs on his HPR drag Zilla and I responded that it was completely doable for me to do that and nothing... You guys act as though I'm lighting Jesus himself on fire because my opinion isn't the same as yours is. Or because I can't justify spending 3 times the amount for port and machine work that is done by an employee of HPR based off of a port design template. Do all builders have the same templates no and I never said that but the general principles of porting a cylinder are the same no matter who you are. If you're a decent machine shop you're probably capable of the same thing as any other machine shop if you have the proper tooling and experience.

Zilla273 · « **Reply #74 on:** April 27, 2013, 07:42:38 pm »

there is so many things involved with porting, how can anyone talk as if its all almost the same??? are u thinkin 2 and 4 strokes porting is the same???

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Author Topic: Performance x 2! (Read 10197 times)

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