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Author Topic: Spark Plug Question  (Read 3564 times)

Offline Roach

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Spark Plug Question
« on: October 07, 2012, 07:55:09 am »
I am running a B9EGV with .020 gap on it. what do you guys suggest or run?
92 lt250r                                  86 lt250r
bartlett racing motor                 ftz motor
Q pipe                                flying machine fac. pipe

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Offline Roach

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Re: spark plug
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2012, 07:56:43 am »
can someone explain all the diff types and differences between em. if not i can google it but surely im not the only one wondering about plugs
92 lt250r                                  86 lt250r
bartlett racing motor                 ftz motor
Q pipe                                flying machine fac. pipe

Offline Heminutt

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Re: spark plug
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2012, 11:30:02 am »
i run b8egv in my 500 and b9egv in my 250s
89 zilla Bartlett racing Dune Porting,42.5mm rx'd carb,DrQ pipe, vf3 reeds
 89 lt250r custom frame with Bartlett racin Dune Porting, DR Q pipe, zilla carb, vf3 reeds
 00 426ex 12:5 comp, stage2 cam, full yosh exauast, +2+1 a arms, +2 lons

Offline Rogue1970

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Re: spark plug
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2012, 12:10:26 pm »
Lots of opinions out there for plugs.  I'm running the cheap B8ES copper core non-resistor plugs, gapped at .020; with a 5k resistor spark plug cap.

Some basic info (little internet research):

BR8ES

B= 14 mm thread diameter
R= Resistor Plug (no 'R' = Non-resistor)
8= heat range (9 cooler, 7 hotter)
E= 19 mm thread reach
S= Plug core

Cores:
S= 2.1mm copper electrode
G= 1.2mm fine wire nickel alloyed/center electrode
GV= gold polladium electrode for racing use
V= 1.2mm fine wire platinum electrode
VX= .7mm high performance platinum electrode
IX= .6mm fine wire iridium electrode

Can somebody knowledgeable chime in on pro's & con's of running the different core plugs (S, IX, etc) different heat ranged plugs (7,8,9), non-resistor plug w/ non resistor cap, resistor cap w/resistor plug, indexing plug benefits (if any)?   For quads in general and the 2-stroke zilla specifically.

I've read that a 9 heat range plug (colder) is Ok if you are racing under W.O. all the time and a 7 heat range plug (hotter) is OK if you putt around and don't use much/any full throttle.  Idea is only run the hotter plug to keep from fouling out your plug.  Personally I think the B8ES/BR8ES plug is the right one for the zilla and adjust your jetting to your quad/environment... but I'm no expert.

Offline Stpltn250r

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2012, 01:38:05 pm »
I was told at one time the thinner wire plugs were designed for ignitions that had a weak spark signal. It takes alot less to fire a spark on smaller electrode than a larger electrode.

Offline Nopick

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2012, 04:16:51 pm »
I have been running the B8ES on my LT250 for 23 years and now on the 500 for almost a year.  It lights off the mixture just fine and I have never had a problem with fouling them. Cheap and reliable in these machines, for general riding anyway.  I am not much of a racer.

Offline Quadster

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2012, 05:40:01 pm »
x'2 on  the b8es/br8es. Also if you dont notch enough on your hybrid there is the br8ecm, shorter plug.

Offline Pipe-Ster

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2012, 08:55:17 am »
I run BR9ES in everything but I run good ignition on all my bikes. Small tip plugs require less spark energy so if a small tip plug works better for you chances are your ignition in week.

Offline El Diablo

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2012, 10:11:44 am »
I run BR9ES in everything but I run good ignition on all my bikes. Small tip plugs require less spark energy so if a small tip plug works better for you chances are your ignition in week.


What is your preference for good ignition systems? What options are out there for the LT-250 & 500?
Brian
1988 Suzuki LT-250R (The HPR test mule)
1987 Suzuki LT-500R
1990 Suzuki LT-500R
1982 Honda ATC-185S
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Offline Stpltn250r

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2012, 10:29:11 am »
Well. Not really a good ignition out that is bolt on ready for the lt500 yet.

There is a PVL set up. But when you set it up for whatever you need you max lead timing at, say 15* like stock timing is at 5500rpm. That would mean around 10* advanced btdc to get 15* at 5500rpm. That would equal 10* start up timing. PVL has a built in timing curve and the only way to change it is the intalled seeting at a certain measurement from tdc. Im probably off but you get the point. The initial timing is so high, it kicks your ankle back through your shoulder. Sure you could tame it down to get it to start, but why sacrifice power and timing just to start the bike?

Some can be retrofited to work. Some say the lt500 stock ignition works very well, but some guys would like to change a little here and there.

The MSD 4217 is what I have on my liger. I know its not a zilla anymore but still has been adapted to work without modifying cases. Just a different stator plate and modified flywheel. And battery and coil. You may get away with running a stock flywheel but would be limited to the pickup tab width for timing. By having a different flywheel and using magnets you can have a vast amount of timing at any given rpm if you need it.

I have read that someone fit a cr ignition on a 250 or 500. Think it was maxx from the other site.

Offline El Diablo

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2012, 10:50:08 am »
Thanks for the input Chris. Are you running dual ignition on your Liger?  When I first got into ATC's & ATV's in the late 80's, we all thought the Answer Roost Boost was the hot ticket. lol. I do know that Matt Hatfield said he was looking into a way to sell a complete bolt on CR ignition package.
Brian
1988 Suzuki LT-250R (The HPR test mule)
1987 Suzuki LT-500R
1990 Suzuki LT-500R
1982 Honda ATC-185S
1982 Honda ATC-250R

Offline Stpltn250r

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2012, 12:30:16 pm »
Yes I was running one. If you do run a twin plug head you will need to run two seperate coils.

Offline Pipe-Ster

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2012, 01:26:40 pm »
What is your preference for good ignition systems? What options are out there for the LT-250 & 500?
[/quote]
If you want to keep it simple use a stock ignition and open your plug (BR9ES) gap .002 at a time until it starts to miss. If you have to run .014-.020 then your ignition is week. Try to see about getting a newer set up thats not 25-30 years old. If you want everything you can get msd is the way to go but you will need alot of dyno time. Our 250r's stock 25 yr old ignition is week but a new stator and flywheel you can run .035 gap.

Offline Toydoc

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2012, 12:49:49 am »
I've never seen any hp gain from changing spark plug gap from .020 to .030.
But you can have a high rpm miss if you start to open the gap up.

If you change factory heat range to keep plugs from fouling, you have something wrong (jetting, fuel, ign)

Offline WestTexasKing

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2012, 12:38:11 am »
I was told at one time the thinner wire plugs were designed for ignitions that had a weak spark signal. It takes alot less to fire a spark on smaller electrode than a larger electrode.

That's not what they were designed for.
It's the fact that a small area (or pointed tip for that matter) allows a spark to form with less energy required, so they're useful in ANY ignition.
Any time you reduce the energy requirements to make a spark, you get a more powerful spark.
It also doesn't make the spark smaller in diameter, nor does a larger electrode make a bigger diameter spark, if that's what you're thinking.

Offline Iceracer

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2012, 09:58:07 am »
One of the arguments to a small wire electrode is that there is less chance for multiple concurrent paths so you get one good spark instead of multiple weaker ones. Smaller tip also heats up and cools faster so its more likely to clean better and not pre ignite fuel.

Offline Stpltn250r

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Re: Spark Plug Question
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2012, 11:46:53 am »
I was told at one time the thinner wire plugs were designed for ignitions that had a weak spark signal. It takes alot less to fire a spark on smaller electrode than a larger electrode.

That's not what they were designed for.
It's the fact that a small area (or pointed tip for that matter) allows a spark to form with less energy required, so they're useful in ANY ignition.
Any time you reduce the energy requirements to make a spark, you get a more powerful spark.
It also doesn't make the spark smaller in diameter, nor does a larger electrode make a bigger diameter spark, if that's what you're thinking.

What you said was what I was thinking but said it in a different way. I should have said it takes less energy to create a spark.

 

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