i like all the ideas i certainly am going to try them out to see which i can get to work ,has anybody tried the procedure of reverse gravity bleeding seems as it would work , hang a bottle of fluid like a iv bag and connect the hose to the **** bleeder and the air bubbles go up through the m/s instead of going down against gravity but i was not sure about it because of the fact i could not get air to go from the brake line screw hole up through the master cylinder . any body know any reason air would not flow up through it .