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Need your advices guys as im a novice
Striped the top end earlier as it lost compression only to find a few surprises
I started with the head as there was a little to much sealer used
Well i seem to think thats to much! Off it came to find sealer all in the waterways ect so i checked the water pump to see if there was any sealer in there! Only to find none lol
So i took the cylinder off to find two base gaskets was used
Can anyone shed any light to why there was two? I can only think to rise the compression/timing? And then find this too 
Sand or some sort in the water/channel ways?
Checked the cylinder over only to find cracks in the inlet port Looks to have been ported a little to much 
Theres very little material left between the liner if that makes sense! I was thinking if there a way this is repairable? Maybe adding more material? Like i said im a novice so dont shoot me lol
Bore size is 68.50 and engine im told is a 89
Pics should be able to tell more
Also pics of the bore
More pics here if i've missed any
http://s223.photobucket.com/user/arcorsagsi/library/lt250r?sort=2&page=1 -
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I do not think that the crack in the base gasket surface is a problem. The coolant leaking into the engine is a big problem.
Is the crud in the water jackets corrosion or from using a dirty bucket to fill the radiator.
The damage to the head looks like old damage, not something that has happened 5 minutes before it was last shut down.
Two base gaskets will raise the ports and lower the compression unless a motor builder machined 0.5 mm off the head or base gasket surface and had to use an extra gasket to get the ports and piston to head clearance where he wanted it.
There are guys on a lot of forums that recommend adding another base gasket in an attempt to avoid spending money on porting. Adding a gasket or doing the correct modification to the ports will produce entirely different results. -
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They did port the snot out of that jug didn't they?!!
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I do not think that the crack in the base gasket surface is a problem. The coolant leaking into the engine is a big problem.
Is the crud in the water jackets corrosion or from using a dirty bucket to fill the radiator.
The damage to the head looks like old damage, not something that has happened 5 minutes before it was last shut down.
Two base gaskets will raise the ports and lower the compression unless a motor builder machined 0.5 mm off the head or base gasket surface and had to use an extra gasket to get the ports and piston to head clearance where he wanted it.
There are guys on a lot of forums that recommend adding another base gasket in an attempt to avoid spending money on porting. Adding a gasket or doing the correct modification to the ports will produce entirely different results.
Crack in the base gasket? Gasket came off free with no breaks? What makes you say its loses coolant?
The crud felt like sand not dirt, So dont know what that would of caused other than problems! I do know the old owner used to ride it on beach's so more than likley that! -
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They did port the snot out of that jug didn't they?!!
Yeah they did If the sleeve was to be removeed that bit would fall out
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Just to make it more clear
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The "crud" looks like radiator sealer. I'd think its time to locate a new cylinder.
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The "crud" looks like radiator sealer. I'd think its time to locate a new cylinder.
Might be but it did feel like sand I think your right 
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Just to make it more clear
My cylinder has the sleeve showing through like that only the ports in mine are a whole lot smoother (and a bit bigger; still havent figured out who ported and stamped my jug) lol
and the cracks that you pointed out in the second pictures are the cracks in the base gasket surface that Mr. Hall was referring to -
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At least im not the only one with this problem then lol, Oh i understand now that'll be why it was smoking a little
Im seriously considering throwing in my spare gsxr600 engine in if i cant get the cylinder/jug fixed
But im sure il miss the 2 stroke pleasure you get from them
Decision decisions
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It smoked because its a 2-stroke and you have a lot more problems than the sleeve showing through. You had one of the most reputable engine builders for these engines tell you that the cracks on the bottom weren't any problem. Honestly your biggest problem is finding out what the grit in the water jackets were (and I agree with Voodoo on it being radiator sealer) and getting a new dome for the cool head.
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The Suzuki manual recomrnded a small amount of rad sealer when doing the water pump and/seals. A small amount... That looks like they dumped a jug of pepper, or Bars leaks in it. Bars does end up looking sandy after its been ran through the system. The radiator on my brid was so packed full of that crap, I had to acid flush it. The engine was even worse.
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Ok i understand it better know! So its radiator seal that blocked it What would that of caused? Any damage to the bottom end?
I've been looking at new cylinders and there not as much as i thought they were brand new! So more than likely look at that option
Any more advice welcome as its all helping me
Thanks guys
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Bottom end should be fine, its always a good idea to do the water pump and seals while you've already got it apart. DON'T OVERDO THE SEALER!!!
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Thats good to hear, Im getting somone to look it over anyway as the crankcase needs splitting as it was jumping out of 2nd gear so think the shift fork is worn! Well i hope it that
Thanks guys. -
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I do not think that the crack in the base gasket surface is a problem. The coolant leaking into the engine is a big problem.
Is the crud in the water jackets corrosion or from using a dirty bucket to fill the radiator.
The damage to the head looks like old damage, not something that has happened 5 minutes before it was last shut down.
Two base gaskets will raise the ports and lower the compression unless a motor builder machined 0.5 mm off the head or base gasket surface and had to use an extra gasket to get the ports and piston to head clearance where he wanted it.
There are guys on a lot of forums that recommend adding another base gasket in an attempt to avoid spending money on porting. Adding a gasket or doing the correct modification to the ports will produce entirely different results.
Crack in the base gasket? Gasket came off free with no breaks? What makes you say its loses coolant?
The crud felt like sand not dirt, So dont know what that would of caused other than problems! I do know the old owner used to ride it on beach's so more than likley that!
The speckled dark spots in the bore are rust that has been polished off after running. The bore also shows polishing that results from water getting in it while it is running and or there is not enough oil in the fuel. The glue on the head gasket is usually a sign that the previous owner was having head gasket problems and thought it could be solved by using more glue instead of machining the gasket surfaces or getting all of the head bolts where they will hold torque.
The rings are also worn out. Look at all of the brown streaks up and down the cylinder that align with the port bridges and near the piston ring end gaps. The brown streaks are blow by past the rings.
A two stroke is suppose to smoke. If it is not smoking it is not getting enough lubrication.
The areas in the intake port where the iron sleeve is showing because of porting is nothing to worry about. -
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Ok thanks for pointing that out, I sort of know what you mean now! Does that mean there will be a little water in the bottom end? The previous owner did mention he had put a new head gasket on, As he said there was a little coolant on top of the piston! But i guess that was coming from the crack!
Was obviously the reason he sold it
Yes i understand a 2 stroke smokes but not like how it did
Shouldn't i be worried though if and when it needs resleeving? Surley im better off with a brand new cylinder? As i think i'm gonna have problems later down the line, Right?
Top end rebuild time obviously?
Sorry for all the questions, Much appretiated
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Just curious what color antifreeze was in your engine?I only ask because if for some reason someone used dexcool(red/orange colored) antifreeze and it goes bad it can make a big mess of sandy brown colored crap.Terrible stuff when it goes bad it erodes metal and will leave a brown mud like color on your skin.See it a lot on GM car and truck engines.If it was green stuff then no problem.
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I recently changed over to the red anti freeze... I wanted the green stuff
Now Im gonna change that crap out! -
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I've been running Dexcool for a few years due to the fact that its supposedly better on engines with dissimilar metals.. Maybe should just go back to engine ice.
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Ok thanks for pointing that out, I sort of know what you mean now! Does that mean there will be a little water in the bottom end? The previous owner did mention he had put a new head gasket on, As he said there was a little coolant on top of the piston! But i guess that was coming from the crack!
Was obviously the reason he sold it
Yes i understand a 2 stroke smokes but not like how it did
Shouldn't i be worried though if and when it needs resleeving? Surley im better off with a brand new cylinder? As i think i'm gonna have problems later down the line, Right?
Top end rebuild time obviously?
Sorry for all the questions, Much appretiated
The crack in the intake area will not allow coolant to get into the engine. A bad head gasket, a base gasket leaking around the water port near the exhaust port or bad head gasket surface is what usually allows coolant to get into the cylinder. Sometimes we find coolant inside of the exhaust port on heavily ported cylinders. -
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Hey Alan. I just got back in town.
Here is what I see.
Your cylinder head insert doesn't look too bad. It doesn't look like there are any high spots. You can replace it if you want to, but you don't need to.
You can take a piece of glass and a sheet of 400 grit sandpaper, get the sandpaper wet and keep it wet, and work the cylinder head cover in a figure 8 motion to remove any high spots. You'll have it nice and flat when the entire surface is uniform shiny. You can do the same to the cylinder head gasket area after you remove the studs.
There's definitely something strange in your water pump cover...
Your impeller looks stained, but healthy.
The skuz in your water passage at the base gasket isn't good. Was there any in the other passage? If memory serves, the 250 has 2 base coolant passages in the cylinder, but only 1 in the cases, the right front.
Those cracks look like bad news to me, as does the amount of steel removed off the intake face of the sleeve, but if MotorGeek isn't concerned, it isn't a problem.
I see rust colored stains in the cylinder water passage. There is no bare steel in the cooling system that I can think of. Hmm.
It needs a bore. No big deal there.
Whoever ported it did a good quality job, at least that's what it looks like to me. -
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Hey Kyle sorry for the delay
Im gonna replace the head insert for peace of mind as its only like $40, Im also getting prices for a new cylinder as i dont really want to use the one we have. Also the guy whos doing the engine work has looked it over and said he wouldn't want to use it either! And as you've also said about the sleeve showing through!
Stained impeller? Could that be a sign the previous owner used water? As it sure looked like water that came out
There was only one blocked water passage! Its all coming apart soon so needs a good flush out ect,
Pics below
The rust colored stains im not sure on? Only thing i can think of is the old owner never used coolant as said it looked like water! Yeah i agree about the porting just maybe gone through to much material!
Thanks for the advice guys
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I don't mind Alan. And I'm sure no one else does either.
A new from Suzuki cylinder isn't going to be cheap. Maybe you can find a nice one on eBay?
That is a possibility, but I can't figure out where the rust would come from. The Zilla has a steel "freeze plug" in the clutch cover, and I'm unsure if the 250 has it or not. Coolant doesn't touch the steel part of the head gasket or sleeve, so that's not it. The only other place I can think of it the mechanical seal behind the impeller. It has exposed steel.
That's good. That's not really a passage anyway. Goes somewhere in the cylinder side, but nowhere in the crankcase side. I never did figure out why that was there... -
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I got a quoted from suzuki £460 But i've found one cheaper here http://www.cheapcycleparts.com/products/538878-suzuki-11210-01c11-0f0-hard-parts-cylinder Or i could keep looking on ebay for a good one? How much am i looking for a second hand one for? Surly its best to get a new one?
I'll have a word with my builder about the rust stains or see if he can see a steel freeze plug when he fully strips the engine Thanks again
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