Author Topic: Reed and filter suggestions (Read 2030 times)

Scawn · « **on:** November 15, 2013, 03:56:30 am »

So as I mentioned in my introduction post, we ordered a 38mm APT SmartCarb for our 1987 LT500R. I just had a few questions while waiting for it:

1. Are the stock reeds a good set up or is there a better aftermarket to go with? Just running an FMF pipe right now and don't plan on doing anything more with the motor. We'd like to order new reeds and I wasn't sure whether to order stock replacement reeds, a V-Force 3 setup, or something else.

2. What's the best / most commonly used air filter or does it matter? Uni or Twin-Air is my preference.

3. I want to go ahead and replace the throttle cable so everything is new / smooth when we put the carb on and we'll need one with some adjustment in it. Are Motion-Pro cables a good one for the quadzilla?

I've also got some clutch questions but I'll probably start another topic on that one.

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #1 on:** November 15, 2013, 06:57:37 am »

Quote from: Scawn on November 15, 2013, 03:56:30 am

So as I mentioned in my introduction post, we ordered a 38mm APT SmartCarb for our 1987 LT500R. I just had a few questions while waiting for it:

1. Are the stock reeds a good set up or is there a better aftermarket to go with? Just running an FMF pipe right now and don't plan on doing anything more with the motor. We'd like to order new reeds and I wasn't sure whether to order stock replacement reeds, a V-Force 3 setup, or something else.

2. What's the best / most commonly used air filter or does it matter? Uni or Twin-Air is my preference.

3. I want to go ahead and replace the throttle cable so everything is new / smooth when we put the carb on and we'll need one with some adjustment in it. Are Motion-Pro cables a good one for the quadzilla?

I've also got some clutch questions but I'll probably start another topic on that one.

Different reeds will not make very much difference on stock ports, FMF pipe and a 38mm carb unless your reed petals are broken. Contrary to popular myth, replacing reed petals that are not completely closed will not usually improve the performance or carb tuning. Petals that are not completely closed will close completely in a running engine!!!!!

It sounds like you are prepared or in the process of spending a lot of money for things that will not make any noticeable difference in power but POSSIBLY run better because the new carb may POSSIBLY meter fuel more precisely. Why not spend a few dollars and make your stock carb meter fuel to the engines needs? There is not any magic in carburetors. I have not seen any breakthroughs in carb technology in the 40 years I have been working on two strokes. You just need someone to set up your carburetor properly.

If you are planning to do engine work we make a bigger higher flowing reed assembly that uses the V2 Force cage for the 1987 cylinder.

Scawn · « **Reply #2 on:** November 15, 2013, 07:53:57 am »

We went with the 38mm APT SmartCarb for a few reasons. First of all, no more jetting. Also, APT claims that the SmartCarb has proven to provide a broader powerband in most applications both on the track and on the dyno. That being said, we took a step down to the 38mm instead of the 40mm so that the quad would be a little more rideable before hitting the powervalve instead of constantly being on the pipe. I'm pretty sure we're going to be the first to try this carb out on the quadzilla and I'm confident it is going to be a blessing over the stock 87 Mikuni, but that's not really saying much, LOL. I was looking to replace the reeds and air filter with fresh components before the carb came in so that everything around it was "clean" if you know what I mean. It wasn't in hopes of a performance gain at all. Just not sure how old the reeds in this motor even are because we haven't taken anything with a gasket off yet.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #3 on:** November 15, 2013, 08:27:18 am »

How much was the apt smart carb if you don't mind me asking? And what do you mean you went down from a 40 to a 38? The 500's all came with 38mm carbs.

Scawn · « **Reply #4 on:** November 15, 2013, 10:14:41 am »

Don't mind you asking at all. The cast carb is $375 plus $24.99 shipping for a total of $399.99. What I meant by "took a step down from a 40mm" is that APT's Buying Guide suggests a 40mm carb for a 500cc motor.

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #5 on:** November 15, 2013, 01:44:39 pm »

Quote from: Scawn on November 15, 2013, 10:14:41 am

Don't mind you asking at all. The cast carb is $375 plus $24.99 shipping for a total of $399.99. What I meant by "took a step down from a 40mm" is that APT's Buying Guide suggests a 40mm carb for a 500cc motor.

There a lot of variables that influence the proper size carb for a given engine displacement. The amount of power an engine makes is not always the deciding factor.

A stock YZ 125 has a 38 mm carb and makes 28 to 30 RWHP. A stock LT 500 has a 38 mm carb and makes 45 to 50 RWHP.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 15, 2013, 01:53:18 pm »

Dang $400 for a carb that adds no real power gains other then no rejetting. It's not like rejetting and tuning a carb is hard or costly. I could think of a lot more id do with $400 to my Zilla.

All American · « **Reply #7 on:** November 15, 2013, 02:50:21 pm »

However for people like me, who have read and reread jetting threads, but still am clueless how to tune carbs,... it sounds like an easy way around the jetting issue. I can turn a wrench just like the next guy but it is hard for me to understand the way carburetors are adjusted and how to figure out what adjustments to make when I'm out riding. If that carb can adjust itself, I may think about getting one for my 250 for shear convenience once I start rebuilding it. Post up a pic please.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #8 on:** November 15, 2013, 04:45:50 pm »

First time I ever tuned a carb was on my 500 took a little bit trial and error shooting videos for the guys on here to tell me what to tune I had it in no time. Guys on the trail last weekend couldn't believe how well my bike was tuned and how little it smoked being mixed 25:1 and being pig rich on the main jet.

GrkGuy · « **Reply #9 on:** November 15, 2013, 05:06:20 pm »

if it wasent smoking then your running it hard enough.

Scawn · « **Reply #10 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:07:17 pm »

Quote from: All American on November 15, 2013, 02:50:21 pm

However for people like me, who have read and reread jetting threads, but still am clueless how to tune carbs,... it sounds like an easy way around the jetting issue. I can turn a wrench just like the next guy but it is hard for me to understand the way carburetors are adjusted and how to figure out what adjustments to make when I'm out riding. If that carb can adjust itself, I may think about getting one for my 250 for shear convenience once I start rebuilding it. Post up a pic please.

The top knob is the rich / lean adjustment on the needle, the side knob is the idle adjustment, and of course there's the choke. Again, it's not ALL about no more jetting, but that did direct us towards this instead of a Keihin AirStryker carb which probably would have ran $275 anyway.

Scawn · « **Reply #11 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:09:31 pm »

I'm still not getting the answer to my original question though, just a lot of opinions about the carb. Should I just get a set of OEM reeds and a UNI filter to make sure things are fresh? Also, has anyone used the Motion-Pro throttle cable?

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #12 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:22:34 pm »

Post a picture of your current reed cage and reeds. I have a custom made motion pro throttle cable for my stock mikuni tm38 bored to 41.5mm using the moose dual gasser throttle. I have no complaints with my motion pro cable accept that I should've had them make the adjuster bigger. I have no comment on the uni filter I know a lot of guys on here are running them with the factory air box and the bracket that's in the store on this site so you can run a clamp on filter. I'm running a custom airbox I designed with a 9" k&n filter and water resistant outerwears pre filter.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #13 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:24:43 pm »

On another note you could've had your mikuni dialed in for the cost of some jets and tuning time less then $40 and a few hours tuning.

QuadMan8 · « **Reply #14 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:28:01 pm »

If getting new reeds I would get the new v force 3's. They are going to be as well or betters than stock on a stockish motor and if you opt to up the power they are way better and your not buying twice. I have always had good luck with the uni foam filters and thats what I ran for years with my airbox. I am ditching my box and going to try a big 9" dry filter (overkill)

To me the idea of a self adjusting carb is appealing (though I am open but cautiously and optomistically skeptical) Glad to see you test this out.
I ride from 4000 feet to 13000 feet--from 20 degrees to 100 degrees (no, not the same day) but jetting is a pain to me---Buckeye--if it were so easy why was she still pig rich.

I trust Motergeek that if something significantly better were out there he would probably be doing it---but I am glad to see new people testing new things for out zillas.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #15 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:31:42 pm »

Maiden voyage my man better to be rich then lean and better safe than blown up. That and I didn't get to do my shake down ride to open it up and do plug chops so I left it pig rich on the main.

And I second Quadman I'm glad you're taking the endeavor to test out this new smart carb I've heard about it and been on the site a few times but haven't heard any direct reviews related to a 500.

GrkGuy · « **Reply #16 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:32:36 pm »

i wouldnt get oe reeds, go for the v force, around $130. or just upgrade with some carbon fiber reeds for the stock cage.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xlt500+reeds&_nkw=lt500+reeds&_sacat=0&_from=R40

and the fuel cell on that carb look small, i hope it does not run out of fuel when your on a long pull. but it looks pretty nice.
good luck with it, and i hope it works good for you.

QuadMan8 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:33:59 pm »

Ohh that makes sense my friend---Im just bustin yout chops-Buckeye

Scawn · « **Reply #18 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:49:21 pm »

Quote from: GrkGuy on November 15, 2013, 09:32:36 pm

i wouldnt get oe reeds, go for the v force, around $130. or just upgrade with some carbon fiber reeds for the stock cage.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xlt500+reeds&_nkw=lt500+reeds&_sacat=0&_from=R40

and the fuel cell on that carb look small, i hope it does not run out of fuel when your on a long pull. but it looks pretty nice.
good luck with it, and i hope it works good for you.

Yea, I know it's taking a chance on something new. Worst case is it doesn't work as I hope and we end up putting it on my TRX250R. As for the V-Force 3's, I notice that most of them say 88-90. Is there a reason the 87 is left out of that range? Do I need an 87 specific set and what's the difference?

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #19 on:** November 15, 2013, 09:54:47 pm »

87 is a different reed cage and cylinder all together from the 88+ motors. If you have an 87 large reed cylinder (5 bolts holding the intake on & 6 head bolts) you absolutely need a 87 specific vforce reed setup.

Scawn · « **Reply #20 on:** November 15, 2013, 10:08:36 pm »

Thanks Buckeye. I'll check with Suzuki East and see what kind of price they have on it.

Buckeye513 · « **Reply #21 on:** November 15, 2013, 10:11:59 pm »

If you can find some vforce v2's like the ones motorgeek has everyone I've talked to including Jerry Hall (motorgeek) says they're the best reed setup for the lt500. It's what I have in my motor.

GrkGuy · « **Reply #22 on:** November 16, 2013, 07:02:12 am »

jerry hall has the the vforce reeds,

PowerStrokin · « **Reply #23 on:** November 16, 2013, 11:38:17 am »

If you're engine is stock and your gonna stick with that pipe, just put a set of carbon tech medium tension reeds in it. They aren't listed on their website, but they have them.

I personally don't care for foam filters, but I believe uni is probably the best amongst them.

Scawn · « **Reply #24 on:** November 16, 2013, 12:50:06 pm »

Quote from: PowerStrokin on November 16, 2013, 11:38:17 am

If you're engine is stock and your gonna stick with that pipe, just put a set of carbon tech medium tension reeds in it. They aren't listed on their website, but they have them.

I personally don't care for foam filters, but I believe uni is probably the best amongst them.

We actually talked about switching to a Paul Turner pipe because I believe they are much better. I'm not sure if there is anything considered to be even better than that, but the FMF will do since we aren't looking to go all out with the motor anyway and it's a decent replacement for the stock exhaust. I'm hoping the money was better spent on the carb than on a PT pipe.

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Author Topic: Reed and filter suggestions (Read 2030 times)

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