Author Topic: Can't keep coolant in radiator (Read 1505 times)

Mtsnieg · « **on:** July 01, 2013, 06:06:39 am »

Last week I replaced my waterpump, shaft, and seals. Went riding yesterday with some friends. Went for a 30 minute rip through the woods/trails and we took a beer break. I could see my frame skidplate wet with coolant. I could hear the coolant bubbling in the radiator. Let it cool and took off the cap and raditor was half empty. Fill er up, check for leaks, no leaks. Go for another ride, same thing, half empty radiator. Engine, radiator, and hoses are bone dry on the outside. Seems to be coming out the overflow resevoir. Could it be that my radiator cap isn't holding enough pressure?

GrkGuy · « **Reply #1 on:** July 01, 2013, 06:09:07 am »

did you bleed air out of system, the 500 has a screw on head that will let air out, for the 250 i
stood it up on rear grab bar till i think air is out.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #2 on:** July 01, 2013, 06:41:56 am »

I initially let it idle for a minute or two with the cap off. Didn't know that that bolt was for bleeding. So whats the best way to bleed the 500?

Nopick · « **Reply #3 on:** July 01, 2013, 08:06:55 am »

The stock head on the 500 has a bleeder like the 250. If you have a cool head, just stand the quad up on it's grab bar for a while to let the air escape the head.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #4 on:** July 01, 2013, 08:12:52 am »

So whatdoido? Open the bleeder, then start quad? Run till warm? I never had a bleeder on a quad/bike before.

Q2W · « **Reply #5 on:** July 01, 2013, 08:42:03 am »

I just crack the bleeder until water starts going out. Also, fill up your radiator, leave the cap off, and start your bike up. Give it a few good revs and look for bubbles. You might have a head gasket leak and are pressurizing the coolant system and forcing it out the overflow.

Kreidy818 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 01, 2013, 09:42:54 am »

Or you could do what I did which was have the motor rebuilt, forget to tighten the bleeder bolt then **** yourself on the break in ride when fluid starts pissing out the head. Pretty sure that got all the air out!!!!

WestTexasKing · « **Reply #7 on:** July 01, 2013, 10:10:21 am »

If it's coming out of the overflow tube you have one of two problems....

-The coolant system is overheating (check with temp gauge) or overpressuring (head gasket pressurizing system).
-Your radiator cap is bad (either the rubber seal or the spring is bad).

Figure out which one of these it is and you'll fix the problem.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #8 on:** July 01, 2013, 12:22:24 pm »

Im at the shop now with the Zilla. Im pretty sure the cap is good, but there is nowhere close to test it. I started the Z and **** the bleeder on the head. Some air came out. Took off the cap and blipped the throttle a couple times. Got a desent amount of bubbles. So Ill pull the head and check it. Gotta order a head gasket too. Oh ya, 87 Zilla. Cometic ok for head gasket?

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #9 on:** July 01, 2013, 04:53:35 pm »

The sealing surface in the radiator neck may be pitted from corrosion or may have some type of blemish that is keeping the rubber seal in the radiator cap from sealing.

I made a lapping tool that will correct minor imperfections in the radiator cap sealing surface.

Dezsled · « **Reply #10 on:** July 01, 2013, 05:07:53 pm »

I've ever tested a rad cap, but I read where you put it in some water heating it up. Drop in the cap and watch to see it operate when hot enough..

Zillicious · « **Reply #11 on:** July 01, 2013, 06:26:11 pm »

Dez you test a t-stat by dropping it in boiling water. You need to pressure test a rad cap.
This sounds like a head gasket that is blown and letting combustion gasses into the cooling system. Pull the head and look at the gasket for any breaks. Also check for straightness. You will most likely fi d the problem there.

Dezsled · « **Reply #12 on:** July 01, 2013, 06:46:23 pm »

That's what it was... Duhhhh!

My mind was stuck on the top end I just got back

The wife's klx350s had coolant blowout issues, I put on a kx85 rad cap and it no longer blew out the coolant/overfilling the overflow tank.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #13 on:** July 02, 2013, 04:13:58 am »

I'm gonna try to do a leak-down test in the next day or two, I would assume if the head gasket is causing the problem it should leak air out the collant passages. I've seen higher pressure rated radiator caps, like 30 pounds, on ebay. Hrmpf!!! Have to wait till I do a lead-down to see.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #14 on:** July 02, 2013, 04:22:58 am »

If this ends up beig a bad head gasket, I would like to update the head bolts to the '88 style bolts. Is this a do it yourself upgrade? Pull the old ones, drill and top, and install new ones?

Sledhead · « **Reply #15 on:** July 02, 2013, 05:33:09 am »

Better off having a o-ring installed.

Q2W · « **Reply #16 on:** July 02, 2013, 07:51:03 am »

Quote from: Mtsnieg on July 02, 2013, 04:22:58 am

If this ends up beig a bad head gasket, I would like to update the head bolts to the '88 style bolts. Is this a do it yourself upgrade? Pull the old ones, drill and top, and install new ones?

best just to o-ring the head and while you're in there, have it re-shaped if you haven't already.

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #17 on:** July 02, 2013, 08:46:04 am »

Quote from: Mtsnieg on July 02, 2013, 04:13:58 am

I'm gonna try to do a leak-down test in the next day or two, I would assume if the head gasket is causing the problem it should leak air out the collant passages. I've seen higher pressure rated radiator caps, like 30 pounds, on ebay. Hrmpf!!! Have to wait till I do a lead-down to see.

A leak down test will not always find a leaking head gasket. Sometimes it takes 500 psi or more to flex the head like it does when the engine fires to make the head gasket leak. Your radiator and hoses will not take 30 pis very long.

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #18 on:** July 02, 2013, 08:59:39 am »

Quote from: Mtsnieg on July 02, 2013, 04:22:58 am

If this ends up being a bad head gasket, I would like to update the head bolts to the '88 style bolts. Is this a do it yourself upgrade? Pull the old ones, drill and top, and install new ones?

Installing larger head studs are not necessary if all of the studs will hold 18 to 20 ft-lb if torque. Do not attempt to install larger unless you have a mill. the stud holes must be drilled and tapped absolutely square to the gasket surface. We are having a large number of cylinders that we cannot fix the crooked stud mess that was created by owners and shops that were not properly equipped.

We have had to throw a a lot of heads away that had the stud holes drilled so large that we cannot get the head centered over the bore. Centering the head over the bore is critical when setting the squish and cutting the head for 0-rings.

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #19 on:** July 02, 2013, 09:09:32 am »

Quote from: Dezsled on July 01, 2013, 05:07:53 pm

I've ever tested a rad cap, but I read where you put it in some water heating it up. Drop in the cap and watch to see it operate when hot enough..

Remove the radiator, install the cap, and apply measured air pressure to the radiator hose bibs. Submerge the cap area of the radiator in a tank or bucket of water. Increase the pressure gradually and note when air starts coming out of the overflow line. There should not be ANY bubbles coming from anywhere at lower pressure. If you have a 15 lb cap, bubbles should start coming out of the overflow line around 15 psi. If you have bubbles coming out in other places, find the reason and correct it.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #20 on:** July 02, 2013, 01:28:02 pm »

Ok. So now what is it going to cost me to have the head o-ringed? Who is the man to go to? Will it come back with o-rings. Will he mill it flat if outa spec? Sorry for all the questions, but I want it fixed right and money is getting tight. And what about turn around time. Damn Zilla, I'm hooked on it.

Mtsnieg · « **Reply #21 on:** July 02, 2013, 01:31:32 pm »

oh ya, whats the proper way to test the head studs to see if they're holding torque? Thanks, Matt.

Sledhead · « **Reply #22 on:** July 02, 2013, 03:11:19 pm »

Jerry Hall, AKA "MotorGeek" offers many mods to keep your zilla reliable. I don't know what he charges for the o-ring fix but you can reach him at 1(623)-931-8132

Dezsled · « **Reply #23 on:** July 02, 2013, 03:48:07 pm »

I just had the '88 cyl head /cyl modified by Jerry. He can machine out imperfections up to a point then your head becomes a conversation piece. It's not cheap as the coolant passages are reduced on the exhaust side, squish /dome modified, sealing surface milled flat, oring lands machined in. It came with orings. Expect to spend two Benjamin's

MotorGeek - Jerry Hall · « **Reply #24 on:** July 02, 2013, 11:00:29 pm »

Quote from: Mtsnieg on July 02, 2013, 01:31:32 pm

oh ya, whats the proper way to test the head studs to see if they're holding torque? Thanks, Matt.

Put the head on the cylinder, install the head nuts and see if it will hold 20 ft-lbs of torque. If the torque wrench stops rotating the nut when the wrench reaches 20 ft-lbs the threads in the cylinder should be good. If the nut continues to rotate when the torque wrench reaches 20 ft-lbs your threads are pulling or shearing in the cylinder.

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Author Topic: Can't keep coolant in radiator (Read 1505 times)

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